Alignment and Camber/Toe In NJ. HELP!
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If the tire wear wasn't happening before the service, you might check for some change in the front suspension that may have happened inadvertantly following the servicing and may be causing the positive camber. That would include a suspension knuckle out of the upper arm or the trumpet or a dislodged trumpet or cone out of the subframe seat. Long shots, but it's odd that the issue follows a service.
SE7EN
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There was a Mini at Lake Tahoe for MMW that the driver said darted from side to side. We addressed the front toe...in the parking lot using a tape measure between the front and rear of the two front wheels...and adjusted the track rod ends. There was too much toe-out as would be indicated by inside tire tread wear.
Was not an alignment, but on his run north on the I5, the driver said he could take his hands off the steering wheel and the Mini ran straight.
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Thank you kindly.
I'll adjust it hopefully enough to make it through the weekend. Love how these things are noticed on a long weekend.
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Rather than start a new post, when I'm sure there are hundreds already, I'll post here.
I just got my car back from the shop. They did some work on the brakes and aligned the clutch. I drove it home (200km) and the tire on the driver's side is worn on the outside.
What causes this? Would this be the camber? It looks like that tire is out a bit, but could be my imagination...
It's only the one front tire on the one side.
It could be the camber or the toe in/out alignment.
If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.
Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.
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I use the string method as described above and also a Calver Special Tuning plumb bob toe, caster gauge that works great. I use cheap linoleum tiles with grease smeared between them (two per wheel) to let the car settle after adjustments.
"I drive a Mini. What are you compensating for?"
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Rather than start a new post, when I'm sure there are hundreds already, I'll post here.
I just got my car back from the shop. They did some work on the brakes and aligned the clutch. I drove it home (200km) and the tire on the driver's side is worn on the outside.
What causes this? Would this be the camber? It looks like that tire is out a bit, but could be my imagination...
It's only the one front tire on the one side.
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where did you find your shop?
I have a Moke in Manasquan that needs an alignment,,,has 10" wheels..
Papa Hex
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FINALLY!!!! I found a shop that could do it! Got the car back last night and have been braking it in since. All seems very well indeed. Soooo excited to have her back on the road.
Thanks all!
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I bought them for turntables. I haven't used them yet. The last time I did my alignment was on the garage floor. I bought four steel plates and was going to sandwich ball bearings in between and make turntables, but now I'm thinking of smearing grease in between the plates and leave at that.
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Would love to see pix. Whats the lazy susan for?
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I use the exhaust pipe as a start and stop point for the string and the right height. I use a good quality string, one that is used for chalk line about $3. and I bought a lazy susan from ACE hardware rated at 1000lbs. also a machinist ruler, very small and accurate lines. easy peasy.
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For the string method, you are suspending a string around the car that cuts the wheel perfectly in half. So remove the dust cover and center the string to the axle bolts. Then you measure from the center of the wheel out to the string and make sure its equal on all 4 wheels. Then you measure the front lip and rear lip of wheel in relationship to the string. With that you can see what the toe is.
OR
//www.minimania.com/web/SCatagory/SUSPENSION/DisplayType/Calver%27s%20Corner/DisplayID/1048/ArticleV.cfm
If you type in string alignment in google images you will see all you need to know.
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anyone got pix of the string method showing where you actually are making your measurements from? Hard for this thick skull to actually make a mental picture. May have to go over to Jim's and watch him mime it.
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Thanks Zip. IMHO it would be easier to use a plumb bob and pencil on the garage floor. Luckilly we have a tame local expert - but he's getting on (aren't we all) so I may be reduced to self help someday.
Cheers, Ian
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Yeah, I would love to get down to see you. Just too far to drag the poor thing too:-)
I did not change the cones this time. The car has 42k original miles on it and seems ok. Still, would like to replace them at some point. Maybe a nice winter project. My car rides much better then my brothers with the same mileage so i have to assume either the cones have been replaced, are in much better nick or my brothers are just totally whipped.
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A sort of related question, did you replace the rubber springs all four corners with the other parts? I'm driving a mid 80s that just about beats me to death. I have recently rebuilt everything on my 85 100E and installed it's second set of new springs since 2000. The difference in ride quality is hard to imagine. As soon as I can stop the heater core leak I will be driving the fresh springs.
I could do your aligment and corner weight but I'm a bit far away.
CTR
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Originally Posted by zippypinhead Just drag around a spare wheel/tire, a tape measure, and the dimensions of your car. (wheelbase, track, minimum width between the ramps on the alignment machine, etc.) Or, you could find a nice flat spot, a trailer comes to mind, and set up strings... Lot's of ideas out there if you google "string alignment" |
That sounds good. I think I know almost all the right questions to ask now but physically going there with a spare is a good idea...if I can get soem time.
I just started to look into British specific car places. Thought this could be done anywhere. I have a few calls in that I hope to hear back from today on.
As for the string method, I have read all about it. I would prefer to have it done by a pro where I get a print out of the numbers I am looking for. At least for the initial setup at least.
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Originally Posted by 1963SV2 Can someone please explain the geometry of the "string" solution? I can see it would work if the four segments (front back, left side right side) formed a perfect rectangle. But, do they? Isn't the rear track narrower than the front? (which means the left and right side strings are not parallel). Or is it that that errors in rear toe (which would move the back corners of the string in or out) are so small that errors in the "parallelity" of the side strings don't matter?? Cheers, Ian |
Ian,
You got my curiousity up with that question.... So, I threw together a quick CAD drawing.... Much easier these days than doing all the trig calculations that make my head hurt.
Assuming the following:
12" diameter "bulge" at the sidewalls of the tires
80.156" wheelbase
47.438" front track
45.875" rear track
I wound up with around 0.200" toe out per side. That might make for a bit of tire wear....
That would explain that, when "stringing" the car, they use jackstands or something not easily bumped out of place.
You would measure out from the front spindles so both strings are equal. Then, measure the distance between the two strings and make that distance the same at the rear. And measure to make sure the strings are the same distance at each rear wheel. Might take a bit of fiddling and a few tries but you wind up with two strings parallel & equi-distant from the wheels.
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the string touches the bulge of the tire. front and back. you are measuring the back of the wheel when doing the front to get the toe out.
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Can someone please explain the geometry of the "string" solution? I can see it would work if the four segments (front back, left side right side) formed a perfect rectangle. But, do they? Isn't the rear track narrower than the front? (which means the left and right side strings are not parallel).
Or is it that that errors in rear toe (which would move the back corners of the string in or out) are so small that errors in the "parallelity" of the side strings don't matter??
Cheers, Ian
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