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 Posted: Sep 30, 2014 01:16PM
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US

I agree it would be nice. I wonder the same thing about unmarked parts.  Just redid the rear brakes on my Mazda Rotary Pick-up (even rarer than a Mini!) and had a heck of a time finding rear wheel cylinders- 4 of 'em!  They were in marked boxes, but the baggies inside just had a sticker with DIFFERENT numbers... ALL different, so once out of the box, no way to know what goes where.  If a customer took them out of the box to look at them on the parts counter, oops, they're mixed up!

Specific vacuum advance units are a bit too much to expect for an obscure old carb from any 'general parts' supplier in my opinion.  The number of people who actually understand how they work and how slight differences affect engine performance is statistically zero!  Those people are going to find Jeff at Advanced Distributors to dial in exactly what they want, and they will willingly pay many times the value of the entire distributor for it (and rightfully so!... not at all diminishing the value, just that most of us won't justify the cost).

I'm not trying to make excuses, just the reality we all face. It's very common for parts availability to come and go, and the vast majority of  the good people working in the parts warehouse are simply not going to notice that the supplier has changed brands or that a part we've had for decades has suddenly been 'superseded' to a different part.  Most of the time we find out when you guys call and tell us!  If we keep heading down the path of "all internet all the time", experts like me will be a thing of the past too, and car enthusiasts will have to be MUCH more knowledgeable or MUCH wealthier (or both) to pay big bucks for having an old classic. 

 Posted: Sep 30, 2014 02:12AM
jeg
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I know what you're saying, Jemal, the human race is amazing, but don't you agree or think it would be nice that some parts (vacuum advance units, for example...) should be marked from the manufacturer with either stamped or silkscreened identification?  That some folks are unethical in their quest for restitution is another issue.  I don't argue that mini parts are inexpensive, nor do I hold the position that you're all (MSC or MM; I generally don't buy anywhere else, although MS did sell me a small 5-liter addy Hopkirk jerry can once) getting rich on my unemployment check. 

It's just that I get frustrated over that when I do my homework and track down a component that might do the job and it comes without markings or doesn't fit, I feel as though someone in the purchasing or receiving department didn't talk to the component manufacturer/distributor and question the lack of markings or dimensional tolerance before placing the item on the shelf. 

Sure, I'll place my trust in that the vacuum unit I bought matches the specificatioin and functions as I predicted.  After I function test it on the car, I'll remove it from the car and either use a Sharpy or engrave the specification onto it so that it can eventually go into the evergrowing box-o'bits should the engine ever change spec again.  That it doesn't physically resemble the old-type vacuum unit by having the hose take-off at the top of the can but rather offset on the side of the can doesn't really matter to me.  I just want it to work, and for a long time if needed.

The peasants are revolting...          

"Gone with the Wind" - a brief yet moving vignette concerning lactose intolerance

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 04:12PM
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US

"Compare that with the mini world, where the cars are cheap, and the owners are, in general, going to complain bitterly about price, and will buy the lowest priced part available."

Norm is exactly right!   I took a call today from a 'gentleman' who started right out  "I've got a real problem with poor quality rear wheel cylinders.  They're leaking for a SECOND time and I'm getting tired of changing them".  When I could not find his customer record to see what he bought, he ADMITED that he did not buy them from us!!   Most of the rear wheel cylinders we sell are less than 25 bucks! (and no chronic failures that I'm aware of!) Yet this guy was buying them even cheaper from some no name source or even fleabay, so he could only reach me to complain!   Seriously!!!!  I don't think anyone on this forum is going to complain about price (wink wink, nod nod), but  I'll wager right now that if a supplier offers superior parts (at a superior price), they will listen to the crickets until they close the doors!  I'm talking Mini parts now!

You know that we offer price matching, but there are some ABSOLUTE JUNK bearings and seals out there coming out of India or China that are just STUPIDLY cheap.  If you place such a low value on your time that you want to save $3 on a $6 seal that takes $1500 in labor to get to, well, I feel sorry for your customers.   I've had this exact thing happen over the red primary seal.... what is it, 5 bucks for the good one?

Of course we care about quality at MM and MS and all the suppliers who've been around.  But nobody is getting rich in this business.  We simply have to balance that with what people are willing to pay to keep the doors open!  I'm sure all you good people find it hard to believe, but I actually have people call me to get all the right info, ID their car, figure out exactly what they need then cancel their order as soon as they get a copy showing all the part numbers, as they merrily march over to fleabay.   I have people try to RUTURN parts they bought on fleabay!!!!   If not for all you wonderful folks,  the only Mini parts you'll find a few years from now will be BMW...

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 02:03PM
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We have the same problems here in Oz.
Some parts are now getting CNC machined locally, as the imported ones are rubbish.
Example:
Hi-Los- the Indian made cast alloy ones don't fit the knuckle joint pins. Some won't press in, others you could throw in from 6ft away. The alloy is porrous too.
2 suppliers here (MADMAT is one) now CNC machine them from billet alloy.


 

Kevin G

1360 power- Morris 1300 auto block, S crank & rods, Russell Engineering RE282 sprint cam, over 125HP at crank, 86.6HP at the wheels @7000+.

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 01:06PM
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Now don't get me started!! I do this for a living and all the above is true. I restore and repair all British makes from MG's to Rolls-Royce and across the board it's the same crap aftermarket parts. As suggested it's unpack and inspect, return part for a good one. Sometimes you just have to put up with it because it's all you can get and then you spend time fettling the thing until it's right. Personally I just don't get, it most of the time the main cost of producing parts is the set-up and design for production so why not get it right at the start it doesn't cost more to get it right before production. as for material specification it's all bullS*** materials have improved not got worse, it's a case of using the right materials for the job not the cheapest that will work that count's!! And yes the more expensive the car the better the parts usually even the aftermarket ones but some still stuck just because there building to a price point not for quality. I purchased a layshaft for a Jag moss box and it wouldnt fit into the bores in the case, a phone call bought the comment well yes we know but if you just open the bore in the case they work great! So I got a hard on for this one and called the manufacturer direct and he explained that his shafts were CNC machined to the exact factory Spec, then sent for hardening...........................Which of course made them grow about a thou and a half

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 11:16AM
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US

They just don't build things like they used to.....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Ctin21yrfcA

One of my favorite lines:
Americans love bargains. They just have no idea what it's costing them.
(Source unkown. Just like some of our parts.)

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 10:31AM
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US

Bad parts have been around forever.  A zillion years ago Greg and I were having a private tutorial from a for real mini guru and he said the first thing that you have to do when receiving a British part is to do an extensive inspection.  "Here" he says "let me take a look at the new OEM parts you brought for your gearbox. OK, this one is s***, this one is S***...  Come back when you have good parts."  And so we did and so we do.  OEM , NOS or aftermarket assume it's junk and go from there...

When you buy a mini part its just like Chrismas.  You don't know what you are going to get until you open the box. 

Kerm

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 10:03AM
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CA

An important fact...we had a local Mini parts & service business that failed.  Not long before it vanished I was completing the restoration/modification of the Mini sedan and building up the custom trailer.

I bought new Choke and Heater tap cables...the knobs came off the first time I used them.  Huh???

Well the owner of the business said that Mini owners were cheap, so he ordered the Manager to bring in cheap parts.

I'd say "mission accomplished", though not the mission the business owner likely envisioned.

Putting the MGB back together, I ordered all kinds of stuff - new rubber window squeegees were a joke, new carpet piece was too short for the rear battery tray, coolant take-off for the Offy intake was made in China and so rough I had to massage the casting with files or tear the hose, new chromed valve covers made in China with internal baffles that prevented fitment over the valve gear, cut those out, new motor mounts made in China simply did not fit...yada, yada, yada.

We are Walmarting ourselves into the paupers' bin folks.

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 09:57AM
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GR

guys the mini has been out of production for 14 years now... we re lucky enough to have what we have! on the subject i sufferd alot from bad condensers.. i m changing to electronic asap..

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 09:45AM
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On the UK Mk1 forum its a constant moan.

//mk1-forum.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9865

CV gaitors of top quality are available in Japan at around the £50 mark (thats $100) each, so ya pays ya money ...........

 

Car engines make CO2 and trees absorb CO2. By running your engine you're feeding a tree and helping the environment.

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 09:12AM
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I've read on other forums of the problem of heater control valve failure, instant or at best quick failure of a new unit, people in search of used old units or new old stock. Other parts are problematic also.

With modern manufacturing techniques you'd think quality would be better. With a high failure rate and returns you'd think quality would improve. Maybe planned obsolescence there's still enough "profit" to continue with production.

Where's the pride of quality gone though ?

My wife thinks I'm a hoarder of mini parts, I try to tell her old or used parts are of better quality than current production, it falls on deaf ears.

That's why mini owners stick together, helping one another.

( Getting off soap box, rant mode off )  No point really to make, just shared frustration .

Carry on.

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 09:11AM
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US

cheapest part is the most expensive you will everbuy

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 08:35AM
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GB

MSC and MM are essentially the same - there are three 'blocs' of suppliers, the MSC based ones, the MS ones and the others who (over here) sell crap.

I know from personal experience that MSC care passionately about quality, from the owner downwards, but on some things they are hamstrung by European legislation.  As I understand it, rubber products cannot be made in the same way as the originals were to the requisite British Standard for rubber, as some of the chemicals are now illegal to use.  Every time I get a duff part I tell them, and I know that they have changed suppliers a couple of times for some things which were shockingly bad.
MS also care, I've highlighted a few things to them (with practical demonstration too on one occasion) and again changes have been made.

If you don't contact the big suppliers directly and tell them when things are wrong nothing will ever get changed.

MSC will ship duff parts back (might not apply in the US) so they can inspect them to ascertain the cause of failure.
Don't keep quiet or bottle it up and then rant - talk to the suppliers.

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 08:26AM
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Here's an interesting counterpoint: the classic Jaguar and Porsche worlds. Their parts are expensive (get a parts catalog of what is currently available for XK120~150 era Jags and get a glimpse at how expensive some of those parts are), but they are made by specialists who know their customers can afford it, and will complain bitterly when the parts aren't right, and most of all, they know their customers can afford it.

Compare that with the mini world, where the cars are cheap, and the owners are, in general, going to complain bitterly about price, and will buy the lowest priced part available.

The supplier hears the customer's voice loud and clear, pocketbook-wise and spend their efforts accordingly.

Add to that the wild card of sub-supplier quality control and add to THAT the ever changing world of raw materials and Federal regulations which require changes to chemicals, rubbers and other raw materials which can create issues downstream that can take unfortunate failures of classic car fans to unearth (like the large number of camshaft failures in freshly rebuilt engines that occurred when the new grades of motor oil came out with low amounts of Zinc in them, about 10 years ago), and you see that even the most conscientious supplier is going to have trouble, from time to time.

All that aside, though, I, too was frustrated to get a new vacuum advance recently with NO markings on it (so, its advance is, what, random?). I sent it to Jeff Schlemmer at Advanced Distributors and he sorted it out for me. An extra expense, but cheaper than burning my valves if it was wrong (and it was wrong, so he rebuilt it for me so it was right!).

Norm

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 07:13AM
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US


Rubber parts are crap!

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 06:48AM
jeg
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I guess I should also ask the pivotal question - Do the leading retailers care?

To which I suppose I should also ask, are there alternatives?  I don't mind buying from many, many different supplieres for parts falling in different many catagories, but 'who' sells 'what' in 'superior' quality?  (Quality which used to be 'normal' shouldn't need referering to as superior, but...)  Major retailers such as MSC and MM should have better control.

The peasants are revolting...          

"Gone with the Wind" - a brief yet moving vignette concerning lactose intolerance

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 06:37AM
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US

This has been going on for years. If you order on a monthly basis there is a surprise with each order. A part that had been the same for years was no longer the same quality or even the look. Had a new water pump last 5 hours. Heater valve new flew apart on drive home from shop. Threads that need tapping or chasing. Parts that don't pass Rockwell test for hardness. Beware new clutch cover TO bearing wear plate. They do now wear in months not decades. I feel your pain. Check around there are people fed up and having quality parts made. Get in on the ground floor before prices go up. Steve (CTR)   

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 06:33AM
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I think you should add the rubber parts you buy now. The rubber starts breaking down right away. We were at a car show last weekend and the black rubber was coming off on a car that was finished only 6 months ago.

Jerry

 Posted: Sep 29, 2014 06:07AM
 Edited:  Sep 29, 2014 06:24AM
jeg
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Here's a bit of a frustration-based rant.

I recently received a new vacuum advance unit from one of the largest and a normally reputable supplier.  I made my decision to purchase this particular vacuum advance unit based upon a lengthy and detailed search of Lucas 45D vacuum units as used on minis, MG's and Land Rovers.  The one I selected, Lucas nr. 54424152 (37H8225) should perform thusly: 3-14-8.  Similar in performance to the 37H8379 (6-14-8).  I have a small box of different 'old' vacuum advance units, all with original Lucas stamped part numbers.  Unfortunately, I didn't have 'this one'.

Wouldn't you know, the unit came in an un-sealed or un-taped box which, although it has the proper number on the box, the vacuum unit itself has no markings whatsoever.  So, if someone in the warehouse had 2 units on a table at some point, who's to say that the one I received is in fact that which I ordered!

I think it's really lousy that cheaply made parts are supposed to be good enough.  Some of us do an awful lot of work on our minis after having spent many hours theorizing and planning.  Some of us 'test' our ideas and suspicions on our minis only to find that the thought process was skewed or ill founded.  But we learn from our mistakes, and in doing so, purchase many more parts than 'should be' required.  Retailers should be happy about this, and should, in my idealistic world view, be either more knowledgeable than us or be in a position to insist that parts are manufactured to a high standard. 

Although not quite the same, but imagine an SU carb needle that has a part number and the part description on a website only says something to the effect "fits 1982 - 1985 998cc mini", but not the 'common' identification, and you order it after researching the part number and finding it to be a commonly known 0.090" 'XYZ' needle.  So, you look forward to seeing what it'll do for your project, and it arrives without having been stamped at the factory 'XYZ'.  So, yes, in the case of an SU needle, you can easily measure it, but being not permanently labelled, it's rather hard to put it on the bench with others and find it again.

Not long ago I received a new water pump where the flange didn't fit within the small pulley.  KC recieved one the same day, but his measured 3mm smaller in diameter and fit fine.  Hmmm, same part number, same 'vintage', same supplier.  I re-installed the old pump, which was the same part number, and fitted the small pulley.  A telephone call to the supplier yielded a credit to my Visa card, but that's really not the solution.

I had a new head stud from the competition stud set that woudn't screw into the block.  Sure, they sent a new replacement (2 replacements, actually, one and a spare), but it still cost time and inconvenience.

Thermostats - some have the small plastic anti-backflow jiggly valve thingy, some don't.

New heavy-duty windscreen wipers, sit in garage with wine corks propping them off the windscreen, never get wet and only 2 years old - car is very seldom out of the garage, mostly just a quick jaunt around the block.  First time in the rain, both wiper rubbers split.  I'm now fitting my own rubbers to the blades.

And the list goes on...

It's frustrating; I want better parts quality and better parts consistency.  I feel like I'm peeing in the wind.

 

The peasants are revolting...          

"Gone with the Wind" - a brief yet moving vignette concerning lactose intolerance