I'm running 1.5 forged KD rockers, + Minispares bronze guides with a Russell RE282 cam, before that I had a local VP3 grind in it which I eventually wore out.
My valve lift is .493". Rockers and bronze guides are both over 50,000 miles now, with no wear apparent.

I think this whole "side loading = guide wear" thing is exaggerated, if the rocker height is optimised.
Plenty of folks over here in Oz are still running forged rockers in historic racing, they don't break like cheapo roller ones do.

There is a distinct benefit for running roller tipped rockers on a road car, and that is valve guide longevity.

Suzy has been running an SW5 cam for the last 11 years, and with standard rockers she got through 3 sets of valve guides in quick succession.
Changed to roller tip rockers and the head is still good, despite running bronze valve guides instead of iron.

High lift / short duration cams put an enormous side load through the valve as it opens.  Race engines tend to have a more traditional big lift / long duration which ironically puts less strain on the valvetrain. 

Calver out of stock at the moment.

Terry

I'dd go with Keith Calver's new 1.4s.
The current MSC `forged' (I reckon are cast iron from some machining I had to do on a set) 1.5s are not as well made as the original forged KD ones were, IMO.

I am leaning towards replacing them with a non-roller type, but which one?

So the measurement on the worst offending rocker is:
.010 is loose
.011 is mostly loose, but a little very slight resistance at one point.
.012 is loose with more resistance, but still movable side to side

This is when the gap is set to .015 at the widest point.

Calver 1.4 rockers:
//www.calverst.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=121

Over the years I have tried many different vendors, some I would stay away from. The Titans have held up without a problem, but what is the real benefit? When I bought them 10 years ago, they were expensive, but not the silly money they are now.

Part of them problem is that when you buy a car, they have already been added. Our most recent car has a set from Minispeed?

//www.minimania.com/msgThread/114985/1/1/Identify_Rockers

Terry

Steve, yes, yes, yes, roller rockers have been around on V8 race cars for almost 50 years.  My guess is that the stamped or forged rockers on a big V8 weighs several times more than what they do on a mini, hence value to having light rockers.  Plus it was the big guns like Crane that developed and sold incredible amounts of them over the years.  They ironed out their problems while I was learning to drive in a Morris Minor when Johnson was president.  Another thing is that some ideas do not scale well.  Is the enemy lift Vs the pin to pin dimension, wanky rocker shaft studs or maybe the odd natural frequency innate in a mini engine?  In the end there is zero reason to run them.  There is no HP gain and for sure no reliability gain. 

In the interest of complete disclosure for anyone that doesn't know the Wold Brothers we are more conservative than most in our builds and seldom if ever try anything that isn't proven reliable over a number of years with significant measurable results. 

Years ago we bought a set of 1.5s from MS and put them on the MG Metro 1275.  Worked very well.  ut them on the 1380 and when it was obvious that the case hardening on the rollers was going away and one pin was ovaling out its bore in the rocker arm, I went to MS and the response was, "We'll replace the worn bits."  My response was to toss the complete rocker set in the recycle bin.

Bought Swiftune 1.5s and they were a much more robust design...no issues.

Have just rec'd a set of 1.3s from Mrs. Clause (she didn't make them) but they too appear to be very robust.

Will go on head with new guides, seals, springs, and running off new SW 5 cam with new lifters and pushrods.  Will look to see that the geometry is correct.

We'll see

I agree with Kermit. For road cars.
I've seen cheap 1.5 roller rockers wear flats on the rollers withing 10,000km. When this happens they are worse than standard or forged ones.
Rollers also tend to beat the valve stems up as their radius is less than that on a normal rocker pad.
As for the KD 1.5 forged rockers, mine have now done over 50,000 miles and are not noticeably worn. Neither are the bronze guides...

Not to fuss but why not? I understand not running the cheap ones they fail. Good quality ones like Titan, HS, Swiftune are very nice. Find a Cup car that runs 8000 plus all day long without rollers. As I recall vintage rules did not allow for rollers. What currently available rockes would you run? I'd like to take a look at Calver's new 1.4s. I have a couple of sets of orginial KDs but I'm not crazy about 1.5s. Steve (CTR)

I don't understand why people run roller rockers on a mini.  Eat one cross pin and you are done, $$$.  Many of the racers have switched back to cast rockers due to reliability issues and they simply do not add ANY significant performance increase.  We do have a couple sets on the shelves so it's not a cost issue it's just that we have seen to often at races where failures pop up on a regular basis.  I think the track record for #88 over the last 25 years indicates that lack of roller rockers has not limited it's ability to be a consistant front runner. The juice simply isn't worth the squeeze.

Kerm

I have 1.3 and 1.5 pedestals at the shop. I'll have to set up a head and see what I can do. I'll also check the ratio as well. Steve (CTR)

Thanks

These were 1.3s

Thank you, do you happen to recall if you bought 1.5 or 1.3 pedestals? The shot from the end looks like the arms are to far back from the plug side of the head. We used HS rockets in SB Chevys running saturday night NASCAR late model. I have 970 and 1071 cranks and would love to hear 9000 plus from a mini again. Steve (CTR)

I think you're right....they are out of round ( well, that one )

You've made such a nice clear, steady video.....you should send Minispares a link.  Perhaps they will replace the faulty roller with new

I think I must have posted at the time and my memory may be not be complete.

There were issues with clearance and the push rods. So I bought a set of pedestals that would fix this issue even thought it was suggested they were a "drop in" replacement.

Even with the pedestals and corect shimming, it was not a clean fit. I did not do this work myself as the engine was being built for me. The HS rockers seem to get far more use on MGBs and you will find some discussion of issues on those forums.

Eventually I got my money back and looked for alternatives.

HS rockers

They looked pretty. I have some pictures somewhere showing the interference.

Would you mind sharing you issues with the Harland Sharps. I have a set on shelf still in blister pac. I have been told they are 1.4 and I'm looking for pedistals ( might ask Calver ) to go with them. Did you measure ratio on the HS ones? Thanks Steve (CTR)

They only have approximately 500 miles on them, the same as the engine.

These are not Titans or they have no Titan markings on them. I am not sure who still sells Titan these days. I bought a set of 1.5s from MM several years ago, but wanted to stay away from 1.5s this time around. Even tried the Harland Sharp rockers, but there were fitment issues.

As the engine was built a couple of years ago, but just installed, I am sure I have no warranty. If I remember, at the time no one had any roller 1.3s, so I ended up ordering directly from MS.

I will try to measure the difference.

Then I will conact the vendor.

Terry

I agree, the roller is eccentric. I'd not run them as is.
I would not call Minispares rollers `high end'- they are budget ones, maybe with needle bearings on the shaft. `High end' IMO would be Titan ones or better.
If there are only a couple of rollers eccentric like this, I think spare rockers are available from MSC.

Another problem I've seen with Minispares 1.5 roller rockers lately is bent adjusters. Whoever is making these (China?) is/was heat treating after thread cutting, and they bowed. The ball went around in orbit when rotated, so the rocker ratio was all over the place.
I replaced them all with s/h ones. I had the same problem with 1 set of their `forged' 1.5s. But another set bought since was OK.

[edit] info added

Hi Terry,

Curious, how many miles have you got on them?

I've got 1:3 roller tips on mine, the original 'green' ones with a bushing on the rocker shaft - have had them since 2001 and have an extra set of bushes should that time come.

I've found that I get the best adjustment results if I get down on a knee and am absolutely certain that the feeler gauge blade is parallel to the valve tip.  I've grown accustomed to pressing down on the adjuster screw while measuring, just to be certain that there's no 'droop' at the roller end which could give a false reading.

Of course, wiping the blade side to side as you're doing is absolutely critical too.  Don't know if this helps you, but I can't see any reason for the roller to be other than round (excentric) if the rollers 'roll' freely.

Hope this helps -

I have a freshly broken in engine with just over 500 miles on it.

I have run into an issue with valve adjustment. The engine has 1.3 roller tip rockers. Head has been re-torqued. And I cannot seem to get a consistent setting on two of the valves.

Here is the video where I try to explain the issue:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnxdzGkxWsI

Terry