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 Posted: Apr 15, 2015 03:23PM
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I also recently took Doc's advice and ditched the return spring.

Voila!  no more clutch adjustments necessary.  Just need to check it now and again to ensure nothing too gross is going on. 

Cheers, Ian

 Posted: Apr 15, 2015 08:41AM
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CA

Chiming in only re throwout stop nut and lock nut...with incidental comments.

Looking for fuel in small town Iowa...suddenly could not change gears, red traffic light...stop, turn off motor...shift to 1st...start motor on Green light, see gas station beyond another traffic light.  Repeat process, get to gas pump, turn off motor...say will look at it after filling.  Replace fuel cap, roll away from pump to lower area in station lot.

Say to travel mates, "If I can't sort this in 5 minutes we have a serious problem."  Pop bonnet.  Clutch throwout lock nut is missing, clutch throwout stop nut removed (to parts bin), check clutch arm clearance.  Done.

Incidentally the only Mini I've ever owned that had throwout stop & lock nuts.  Only needed if driver insists on riding the clutch at traffic lights, rail road crossings etc. (the reason Wifey no longer drives my Minis)

Also incidentally, when I renewed the clutch operating bits before heading for Mid-Ohio, I was also considering replacing the clutch throwout plunger...but was cautioned by DRMINI that some are now made from "Chinese Cheese".  Had the new bit Rockwell Hardness tested...woefully soft at 5.9-6.5.  If you install one with this spec, the ball on the lever will soon oval out the plunger and require all too frequent clutch adjustments.

 Posted: Apr 15, 2015 07:47AM
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CA
Image Gallery

Rickysa's pictures seem to show a Verto throw-out lever. Cupcake show a pre-verto arm.

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Apr 15, 2015 07:42AM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cup Cake

Dan, with the pedal depressed there is no clearance, in fact the collar hits the clutch cover before the clutch is all the way in, hence, the term clutch throwout stop. At rest there is a small gap between the collar and the cover. I'm pretty sure its not necessary. This thread came up at an opportune time because it lead to a solution of a clutch issue that came up on my Traveller yesterday. The symptoms were a weird clutch pedal feel and difficult shifting. After looking at the clutch fluid level I had the 'revelation' that it was the throwout stop. Turns out the collar had treaded on the plunger just enough to partially disrupt the clutch action. The collar and lock nut were locked together but not enough to lock them onto the plunger. 

OK, but what is confusing is that you said '1/16s" clearance'. 1/16" is too small > Haynes says "6.5mm" which translates to 1/4".

Must be a typo? (My fingers often mis-quote what I'm trying to write.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cup Cake

OK that eliminates a siezed slave cylinder. Now you need to try to move the clutch lever by itself. You won't be able to move it by hand, it'll take a fair amount of force with a pry bar of some sort. If it doesn't move the the throw-out plunger is siezed or the throw-out stop collar is out of adjustment ie threaded itself toward the clutch cover. There should be at least 1/16s" clearance between the collar and the clutch cover. Some people take the collar off completely. 

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 03:38PM
 Edited:  Apr 14, 2015 04:07PM
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Oh, I have the manual (and parts practically memorized!) from back when I was working on the car...I don't have any experience with clutch/transmission systems in general, so I thought I'd start troubleshooting from simple and go from there.

Time to break out the EasyOff and get busy

Thanks again for all the input!

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 03:06PM
 Edited:  Apr 14, 2015 03:15PM
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Yikes ... that's nasty. The clutch arm looks to be bent or broken off inside. You need to take the cover off and have a look. Its time to buy a Haynes manual and get down and dirty.

The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. G.B.S. Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. Oscar Wilde

//www.cupcakecooper.ca/

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 02:57PM
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another pic:

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 02:46PM
 Edited:  Apr 14, 2015 03:02PM
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Use the picture posting facility  .... the green button to the left of the message posting dialog box.

This is what it should look like.

The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. G.B.S. Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. Oscar Wilde

//www.cupcakecooper.ca/

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 02:36PM
 Edited:  Apr 14, 2015 02:56PM
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Ok, tried to move clutch lever and it moved with a bit of force from a crowbar. It didn't feel "seized and broke free"....just kind of gummy.

but...this doesn't look right to me:

there is a misalignment of the "piston" (which I'm guessing is the throw-out plunger), and the stop collar which you can see at the top of the picture

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 12:50PM
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Dan, with the pedal depressed there is no clearance, in fact the collar hits the clutch cover before the clutch is all the way in, hence, the term clutch throwout stop. At rest there is a small gap between the collar and the cover. I'm pretty sure its not necessary. This thread came up at an opportune time because it lead to a solution of a clutch issue that came up on my Traveller yesterday. The symptoms were a weird clutch pedal feel and difficult shifting. After looking at the clutch fluid level I had the 'revelation' that it was the throwout stop. Turns out the collar had treaded on the plunger just enough to partially disrupt the clutch action. The collar and lock nut were locked together but not enough to lock them onto the plunger. 

The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. G.B.S. Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. Oscar Wilde

//www.cupcakecooper.ca/

 Posted: Apr 14, 2015 05:39AM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cup Cake

OK that eliminates a siezed slave cylinder. Now you need to try to move the clutch lever by itself. You won't be able to move it by hand, it'll take a fair amount of force with a pry bar of some sort. If it doesn't move the the throw-out plunger is siezed or the throw-out stop collar is out of adjustment ie threaded itself toward the clutch cover. There should be at least 1/16s" clearance between the collar and the clutch cover. Some people take the collar off completely. 

Larry, isn't that clearance measured with the clutch pedal fully depressed and clutch disengaged?

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Apr 13, 2015 02:58PM
 Edited:  Apr 13, 2015 03:03PM
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OK that eliminates a siezed slave cylinder. Now you need to try to move the clutch lever by itself. You won't be able to move it by hand, it'll take a fair amount of force with a pry bar of some sort. If it doesn't move the the throw-out plunger is siezed or the throw-out stop collar is out of adjustment ie threaded itself toward the clutch cover. There should be at least 1/16s" clearance between the collar and the clutch cover. Some people take the collar off completely. 

The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. G.B.S. Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. Oscar Wilde

//www.cupcakecooper.ca/

 Posted: Apr 13, 2015 02:45PM
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more info: removed the slave rod from the part that engages with the clutch plate (sorry for not knowing the terminology) and the pedal worked fine (disgorged the piston though). The fluid was really gritty, and I noticed the rubber boot covering the slave wasn't fully secure. I'm thinking a slave replacement no matter if that is the final fix. I'll do that next and see what happens.

Thanks again for the help...other projects have taken me away from this one and I'm trying to get back in the groove.

 Posted: Apr 13, 2015 11:08AM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by mousy
I had one like this last week . Verto clutch , car sitting for some time , pedal rock solid.Cracked bleeder . Pedal moved. Pulled bolts from slave, pedal moved , slave OK. Put a wrench on the plunger stop nuts and jiggled back and forth , just enough to take up free play in clutch arm. Suddenly the plunger "Popped out" Was seized in the WOK. Clutch worked fine after that . Question is ......how did the plunger seize in the clutch released position ????? Mousy

Probably was seized in the engages position, but first application shifted the seizure. Maybe just enough to disengage. Most of us would probably settle into the driver's seat and put a foot on the clutch without thinking.

 

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Apr 13, 2015 09:25AM
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Thanks for all the feedback...the car has been sitting for over a year, which led me to think something is "stuck". I haven't been able to free the slave arm as yet, but I hope that's what it is. The clutch is disengaged.

 Posted: Apr 13, 2015 08:12AM
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CA
I had one like this last week . Verto clutch , car sitting for some time , pedal rock solid.Cracked bleeder . Pedal moved. Pulled bolts from slave, pedal moved , slave OK. Put a wrench on the plunger stop nuts and jiggled back and forth , just enough to take up free play in clutch arm. Suddenly the plunger "Popped out" Was seized in the WOK. Clutch worked fine after that . Question is ......how did the plunger seize in the clutch released position ?????

Mousy

 
 
 Posted: Apr 13, 2015 01:45AM
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AU

My guess is the clutch hose is stuffed. It is acting as a one way valve. 
You can pump fluid through it but it can't return on its own.

 Posted: Apr 12, 2015 10:34PM
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2nd throw out plunger siezed............

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: Apr 12, 2015 09:39PM
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US

did this happen all of a sudden?  or after a winter storage?  or what?

 

 Posted: Apr 12, 2015 06:29PM
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My money is on either the slave cylinder, linkage or throwout plunger is seized.

Kevin G

1360 power- Morris 1300 auto block, S crank & rods, Russell Engineering RE282 sprint cam, over 125HP at crank, 86.6HP at the wheels @7000+.

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