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 Posted: Aug 14, 2015 11:58AM
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1966 Lincoln Continental was most definitely NOT an electric A/C. It would probably take a 250 amp alternator to cool a 66 Continental with a 12V electric compressor!

The 66 Continental used a big York reciprocating type mechanically driven compressor, as did millions of US cars in that era (and a lot of imports retrofitted with A/C like Jaguars.)

 

 

DLY
 Posted: Aug 14, 2015 06:53AM
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CA

bluedragon:

I think you got the point. However your mention of the 66 Lincoln, tends to suggest it might have been electrically driven, which I doubt was your intention. Just to be clear, was the Lincoln's A/C belt driven off the motor as were the milions of other cars? I don't want our friend to be accidenally misled.

The point remains, 12V electrically driven A/C in a car is prohibitively complex and expensive.

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Aug 13, 2015 11:10PM
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The idea that an alternator of ~150 amps is needed for air conditioning is ludicrous. Over 100 million American cars were built in the 60's and 70's with ice-cold air conditioning, and none even had a 100 amp alternator. The 1966 Lincoln Continental, with a A/C system capable of cooling three Minis, had a 60 amp alternator.

Electrically powered A/C is only feasible for a car with a 48 volt DC electrical system at a minimum. The actual cars that have electric air conditioning are driven with 200+ volt AC (alternating current) systems. As already pointed out, the amps needed for a 12 volt DC system are totally prohibitive. And converting mechanical energy to electric energy (alternator) then converting it back to mechanical energy (to drive a electric A/C compressor) is considerably less efficient than using the mechanical energy directly.

DLY
 Posted: Aug 13, 2015 02:32PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison

yes, can't agree more,,, one of the flaw of the mini engine and transmission  is WHy sir alec allowed the gears to be shifted from 4th to 3rd or from 3rd to 2nd when the car is in motion????how can it be prevented??? i remember there is one member here who has a freshly built 1275 engine and while test driving it, at 40mph he accidentally shift it from 3rd to 2nd then he heard crashing noise inside the engine bay then the car ceased.  modern manual cars don't do this. what's wrong with this design????my goodness!

Source?

 Posted: Aug 13, 2015 01:30PM
 Edited:  Aug 13, 2015 01:39PM
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yes, can't agree more,,, one of the flaw of the mini engine and transmission  is WHy sir alec allowed the gears to be shifted from 4th to 3rd or from 3rd to 2nd when the car is in motion????how can it be prevented??? i remember there is one member here who has a freshly built 1275 engine and while test driving it, at 40mph he accidentally shift it from 3rd to 2nd then he heard crashing noise inside the engine bay then the car ceased.  modern manual cars don't do this. what's wrong with this design????my goodness!

 

 

 Posted: Aug 13, 2015 01:00PM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison

Uncle Dan, the large current or heavy load maybe eliminated or lessen with the use of gear reducer. since we all know that a compressor is hard to rotate when turned on, perhaps a gear reducer will help/  modified small sprocket attached on the 12v motor shaft and big sprocket on the compresssor./  and it will be chain driven/ or belt driven with grove.   a three gear combination might work better.

I'm not your uncle.

Load out = load in. A smaller motor would have to run much faster to produce the "work" needed for the compressor. No matter what the gear reduction, to maintain the compressor's speed under load, the  motor would draw about as much current, probabaly more due to the losses in efficiency of the gear/belt train.

"Kids: don't ry this at home:"

Think of it this way: your Mini should be able to sustain 70mph in 4th gear on level road, giving rreasonable efficiency and not much throttle cruising. Downshift ot 3rd gear and you have to push the gas pedal down alot farther to maintain that speed. That's only a sliight reduction in gearing. Downshift to 2nd and try it. If your valve don't float and your connecting rods don't bend, you will still lose speed because your engine cannot turn that fast. Even if it mechanically could, you'd need another crb to feed it. (Reducio ad absurdum Now, slip it into 1st gear. If the gearbox hasn't disintegrated, and you manage to let the clutch out without going through the windshield, your car will slow down VERY quickly, which is OK because the cylinder head will have come through the bonnet, obliterating your vision with shrapnel against the windscreen, and you'll have to pull over to pick up all the bits, stuff them in the boot and call for a tow.

(I did say don't try it!)

Once in my first car, I was doing about 72mph and the valves floated. The 850cc engine immediately slowed down like I'd shut it off, and it had a permanent knock from a tweaked connecting rod.

 

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Aug 13, 2015 09:23AM
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Uncle Dan, the large current or heavy load maybe eliminated or lessen with the use of gear reducer. since we all know that a compressor is hard to rotate when turned on, perhaps a gear reducer will help/  modified small sprocket attached on the 12v motor shaft and big sprocket on the compresssor./  and it will be chain driven/ or belt driven with grove.   a three gear combination might work better.

 

 

 Posted: Aug 13, 2015 09:05AM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Moffet

I've thought about electrically driven A/C for a Mini. I come to the conclusion that the wiring size would be enormous:

 Assuming 1000watts (an arbittrary number for convenience), divided by 12 volts yields 83 amps.

If I recall corectly, 1 hp = 746 watts. So, if an electric A/C consumed 1000 watts, it would load the engine about 1.34 hp. Since the load would require a big alternator (chatted about somwhere here recently), it would be belt-driven.

Over a conventional belt-driven A/C, we would have added:

  • weight of a/ac compressor (in boot)
  • weight of A/C electric motor (in boot)
  • weight of additional brackets, extended fluid lines and fluid
  • weight difference of larger alternator
  • large wiring, fuse and electrical controls.

Automakers keep it simpler, lighter and cheaper by just tacking the A/C compressor onto the engine and using a longer or second belt. it is also safer by avoiding large-current electrical circuits.

 

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Aug 12, 2015 05:54PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Moffet

I've thought about electrically driven A/C for a Mini. I come to the conclusion that the wiring size would be enormous:

 Assuming 1000watts (an arbittrary number for convenience), divided by 12 volts yields 83 amps.

Coleman RV roof air and a generator in the trunk................Job done....................

Mini's are like buses they come along in a bunch

 Posted: Aug 12, 2015 03:14PM
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CA

I've thought about electrically driven A/C for a Mini. I come to the conclusion that the wiring size would be enormous:

 Assuming 1000watts (an arbittrary number for convenience), divided by 12 volts yields 83 amps.

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Aug 12, 2015 02:08PM
 Edited:  Aug 12, 2015 02:17PM
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so Sir Dan, i want to make a prototype car A/C , if i can only find a high torque/high speed 12v electric motor this project will materialize. you think this is possible? has anybody done this? if this is possible, there will be no mini without  A/C./ the only thing that hinders a mini to have an A/C is cabin Space., but with a motor driven compressor, the A/C system can be situated at the back..

hmmm this made me think., let me do some brainstorming(with myself) over this matter.

 

 

 Posted: Jul 25, 2015 12:12PM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Moffet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

installing an A/C will require you to step up on a higher amp alternator, maybe about 150amps and a new battery. 

 

 

Hahahaha... 150amp alternator for A/c in a car. That's soooo funny, and WRONG.

sir Dan, didnt you know that A/C sucks out to much juice from the battery?  modern cars use 180amps alternators fyi

Every car A/C I have seen is belt-driven off the motor and does not use an electric motor to run its compressor. The only motor in an A/C system is the heater fan motor which may draw less than 15A full-on.

Show me ONE car that has a 150amp fuse or breaker to protect the A/C.  Provide make, model AND wiring diagram for A/C system. (I won't hold my breath.)

 

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Jul 25, 2015 11:20AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Moffet
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

installing an A/C will require you to step up on a higher amp alternator, maybe about 150amps and a new battery. 

 

 

Hahahaha... 150amp alternator for A/c in a car. That's soooo funny, and WRONG.

sir Dan, didnt you know that A/C sucks out to much juice from the battery?  modern cars use 180amps alternators fyi

 

 

 Posted: Jul 25, 2015 11:03AM
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I swear he must be doing a research project on how to pi$$ people off.

If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.

Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.

 Posted: Jul 25, 2015 09:08AM
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CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

installing an A/C will require you to step up on a higher amp alternator, maybe about 150amps and a new battery. 

 

 

Hahahaha... 150amp alternator for A/c in a car. That's soooo funny, and WRONG.

.

"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."

 Posted: Jul 25, 2015 07:10AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boison
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

installing an A/C will require you to step up on a higher amp alternator, maybe about 150amps and a new battery. 

 

 

Really !!!! Show me proof of this as i know the pink wonder does not have a/c.

If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.

Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.

 Posted: Jul 24, 2015 07:51PM
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US

it's going to cost ya a bit ya know..theres a lot of fab work to be done to make it perfect....

 

  then theres the lump...going to need 10 to 15hp more ...

 

    ballpark ..??  1500 ta 3k ...but man...think about how you will be so comfortable rolling on the PCH ....yeah baby....and no more stinky arm pits or sweaty testy's..

 

  ps..ya have to bring er to me...2 to 3wks 

    bad guy ..

                            S-IkF4_iGBY

   

 Posted: Jul 24, 2015 07:32PM
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US
Quote:
Originally Posted by Willie
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

     20mi. south of detroit ricky..

 

                   how much you ask...?? what year and what size lump in the lil beasty ..??

     this is another option ..i can't believe they hacked up a perfectly good mini like this..??  i know the owner of it..he's as goofy as his car....

    bad guy ..

                            S-IkF4_iGBY

   

 Posted: Jul 24, 2015 06:57PM
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US
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

     20mi. south of detroit ricky..

 

                   how much you ask...?? what year and what size lump in the lil beasty ..??

    bad guy ..

                            S-IkF4_iGBY

   

 Posted: Jul 24, 2015 04:36PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB60

Willie would love to get AC. what's your location ?  How much?

installing an A/C will require you to step up on a higher amp alternator, maybe about 150amps and a new battery. 

 

 

 

 

Found 75 Messages

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