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 Posted: Mar 11, 2020 04:31AM
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Sounds like that joke of the Proctologist that got a job at the Mechanics shop.... Repaired the whole engine thru the tailpipe!

 Posted: Mar 11, 2020 04:27AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerOtto

While using a wire to clear the blockage I managed to break the wire and it too became jammed!

This may not be the perfect solution but it did require obtaining a new tank!


Thanks for posting your follow-up Roger.  Just a couple of points. 

1) From what you told me, the wire you broke was a piece of Romex, not the steel cable I suggested. 
2) Also note in the quoted text above you said your process DID require you to buy a new tank.  With the pickup tube cleared and repaired you did not have to replace the tank did you?   

Doug L.
 Posted: Mar 11, 2020 04:27AM
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Now that's determination, nice work.

 Posted: Mar 10, 2020 11:40AM
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Numerous attempts to remove the blockage in the fuel pipe in the tank failed.
In fact I made it worse.

While using a wire to clear the blockage I managed to break the wire and it too became jammed!
Upon closer inspection  I noticed the filter screen was broken one side.

Options --  locate a new tank ($600) or make the best of a bad situation ($3).

I took the following extreme measures :
- cut and removed the fuel pipe in the tank
- removed the filter
- cleaned the fuel pipe
- re-installed the fuel pipe using 5/16" ID fuel line attached with clips

I needed to create a few tools to allow me to accomplish this work through the filler neck
- hack saw blade attached to a long piece of metal shelf support
- screw driver attached to a long piece of metal shelf support
- alligator clip attached to a long piece of metal shelf support
 
The most difficult task was tightening one of the hose clamps while in the tank.
Visibility into the tank is the biggest challenge.  Long piece of metal shelf support must be just long
enough so you look down the metal rod through the filler neck.  I was able to position the screw driver
by looking through the fuel sending hole on the side of the tank.  Would have been nice to have a second
pair of hands and eyes!

This may not be the perfect solution but it did require obtaining a new tank!

I did check out possible filter replacements but ruled this option out.  I did not like the shortness of the
filter and did not want to address additional problems once the tank was in the car.  Since this is an "S"
with a second tank i will opt to install an in-line filter once the mini is operational.

I have no desire to build a ship in a bottle!

I have attached a few pictures.

Please advise of questions.

Roger Williams
 Posted: Feb 28, 2020 01:50PM
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For really stubborn blockages in the pickup tube you can also try the following.

Go to the home center and buy a short length of un-coated steel cable (a.k.a. wire rope) that is about 1/2 the inside diameter of the pickup tube.  Pick one end of the cable apart so the first inch or so looks like the cable is unraveling.  Chuck the other end of the cable in an electric drill. Spray some carb cleaner in the pickup tube, insert the unraveled end of the cable in the pickup tube and start running the drill on low speed.  Keep the cable flooded with carb cleaner as you work the cable in and out until the cable breaks free into the tank.

Doug L.
 Posted: Feb 28, 2020 08:01AM
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I just finished doing the second 20 minute run with no further issues. I stopped and got out to look at the filter many times for the first 20 minutes then just drove back and forth in the driveway the second time. (I am plowing snow while doing this by the way) and all seemed good. I may try going around the block tomorrow when there is someone home that can tow me back if it fails. (not currently road legal)

Anyway I tried all the steps outlined by Doug. however I took a small bottle brush attached to the piece of wire to run up the drain pipe. one of the fancy stainless straw cleaners work well just a bit short. make sure you have it attached well to the length of wire would hate for it to get stuck in the tank.

Roger - I was not able to get it more then 8 or 10 inches into the pipe either I had expected to be able to poke it into the in tank filter but it seemed to just stop.

I then used my 60 liter shop vac and taped it to the filler neck. I put the hose to blow. A spray paint can cover is just the right size to fit in the sender unit hole to plug that so that the pressure from the vac would have to go out all the other holes to help dry them and clear anything out. 
The side of tank bulged a bit because the vac can deliver more air then the little vent tube, return line and drain pipe can get rid of. the Vac say it delivers 314 peak air watts and 200 kph not sure what that means but there is a lot of air coming out of the 2 1/2 hose.

not sure if that was what really did the trick but I seem to be OK now.


Once you replace everything that is attached to something else. It will all be fixed.

 Posted: Feb 27, 2020 05:58PM
 Edited:  Feb 28, 2020 01:21PM
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Just finished cleaning the fuel tank.  Much better than “before”.

i did clean the filter pipe with a piece of wire and was able to remove some gunk. 

It appears there is a blockage in the line. I am able to push the wire in 8 inches.
I tried compressed air (aerosol) without success.

any thoughts?

Roger Williams
 Posted: Feb 13, 2020 10:24PM
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I am not sure why the tanks you have seen have access holes in them.  I have not come across tanks like that.  However, there are various Triumph fuel tanks (TR2 and TR3 maybe?) where owners have had to cut the tank open to carry out repairs.

The picture linked below is NOT to the Mini's in-tank plastic filter (and yes it is plastic).  However, the picture does show the general shape of what is in the tank.  There is plastic mesh wrapped into a cylinder with stiffening ribs to prevent collapse.  There is a solid cap on the far end.  The near end has a hole which allows it to be pressed onto the pickup tube (which is metal).  The filter has to be installed before the two halves of the tank are welded together.

I have not seen a completely plugged tank filter on a Mini but I have had to deal with them on a couple of MGs that sat for years.

https://www.agriculturalmachinery-parts.com/photo/pc19603948-r175_s195_diesel_engine_parts_fuel_tank_filter_element_black_cheap_price.jpg

Doug L.
 Posted: Feb 13, 2020 05:46PM
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Doug, thanks for the post re: cleaning the tank.   this is just one more thing I need to put on my list!

I was curious about the "sock" and have attached a few pictures of what is in my 1966 Cooper "S" tank.
it does not look like either a "sock" or a plastic tube!   there does seem to be a "cap".

is this the reason I have seen some tanks with a hole cut into the "hidden" side (and then welded)?
is this to clean the inside of the tank and/or to clean/replace this filter?

Roger Williams
 Posted: Feb 12, 2020 05:08PM
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My advice on tank cleaning is to focus on the gum and varnish that fuel can deposit over the years, particularly if the car sat for a while.  Don't worry about rust at this point.

This is what I would do.  Others will have different recommendations.
Drain and remove the tank.  Remove the sending unit and cap/plug all openings.
Pour a quart of strong paint stripper in the tank. 
Throw in some nuts and bolts or gravel.
Slosh it around every half hour over the course of a day.
Drain the tank and pour in a quart of strong caustic cleaner (I use ZEP Industrial Purple from the home center).
As with the paint stripper, slosh every 30 minutes or so over the course of a day.
Drain the tank making sure to get all the nuts, bolts, & gravel out.
Take a heavy gauge wire (a strand of Romex or similar) and run it up the pickup tube from outside the tank all the way to the filter in the tank.
Remove the wire then blow into the pickup tube with compressed air.
Rinse the tank with water, then pour out the water and rinse with a cup of isopropyl alcohol or acetone.
Pour the alcohol or acetone out and allow the tank to dry.

That should get rid of any gum and varnish in the tank and should have cleaned the in tank filter and pickup tube.  It will only remove the loose bits of rust scrubbed off by the nuts, bolts, and gravel.

Doug L.
 Posted: Feb 12, 2020 01:25PM
 Edited:  Feb 12, 2020 02:14PM
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forgot to mention if I drive until it shuts off I can just sit and wait 5-10 minutes and then it starts and I can drive again. not sure how long it runs for the second time cause I usually just put it back in the garage until it snows again. I am down to about a 1/4 tank now and can soon take it out to clean. I really did not want to have to drain it.


Once you replace everything that is attached to something else. It will all be fixed.

 Posted: Feb 12, 2020 01:10PM
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Doug. I could take the electric pump off my car and try that. I have tried opening the cap when it starts to stumble while sitting at idle with no change it still quits. what I have observed was when I thought it was about to stall I stopped and jumped out and checked the clear filter I have just about the rear wheel well. because this is on a 4x4 frame it is easy to see. 
I was able to see the level of fuel in the filter change as it ran. when revved up the fuel would "drop" out of the filter. until it was empty. as in no fuel coming out of tank. I shut the engine off and watched as the filter "filled up"
this is why I believe there is an issue with the in tank screen/filter.

any recommendations on a cleaning product?


Once you replace everything that is attached to something else. It will all be fixed.

 Posted: Feb 11, 2020 06:52PM
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I thought we were talking about different things until I saw your second photo.  The sock isn't a sock.  It's a plastic screen filter.  It is pressed onto the pickup tube prior to the tank being welded together.

Check the pump and check for a plugged vent line before removing the screen filter from the pickup tube.  If you have a low pressure electric fuel pump (below 3.5 PSI Max), use it as a test to supply the SU carb instead of the pump on the block.  To check for a plugged vent tube, drive the car until the problem starts then quickly remove the gas cap while you listen for an inrush of air.  You can also just try blowing back through the tube to confirm the tube isn't blocked.  (Bugs can get into almost anything).

The screen filters can plug if you have lots of big silt in the tank.  If you determine the filter is at fault, I would clean the tank out before trying to remove the filter.

If you are convinced the filter is at fault, you can get it out using a long steel rod through the filler neck.  Catch the end of the rod on one of the filler ribs and then strike it with a hammer.  Shift around to a few different places and strike again.  It will come off.

Again, remove the screen as a last resort.  While you can get the filter off you will NOT be able to put it back on if you change your mind.

Doug L.
 Posted: Feb 11, 2020 03:43PM
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Maybe it is a Canadian market requirement.
The UK ones I have seen are just a piece of tube welded to the bottom of the tank and pretty much flush on the inside.

Yours looks a better design the way it is positioned it does not pull all the crud from the bottom.

Put some air pressure to it I am sure it will blow off easily.


If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.

Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.

 Posted: Feb 11, 2020 02:08PM
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Here is a better photo of My Daughters mini and a clearer shot of the "sock"
https://photos.app.goo.gl/cXfoZWbTUMUy7Mh97
 My mini has the same and I noticed there is crud in the bottom of mine.


Once you replace everything that is attached to something else. It will all be fixed.

 Posted: Feb 11, 2020 02:05PM
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Just went and stuck the phone in the filler neck. this is the actual tank and bad hard to see sock in the middle.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/ZNoW2cHiHAATq5Jk8


Once you replace everything that is attached to something else. It will all be fixed.

 Posted: Feb 11, 2020 12:51PM
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In my younger days we had this problem on a lot of V8 70's domestic cars.
Our easy fix was to take off the fuel cap and put air pressure to the fuel line obviously before the fuel pump, we usually had someone by the fuel tank and he could hear it release. You can then get a piece of wire with a hook bent on the end and fish it out or use one of those 3 clawed grab tools if it is long enough.

Remember to install a fuel filter in the line if you don't already have one.

FWIW I have never seen a fuel sock in a carbed  Mini tank, spi's and mpi's have them though.


If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.

Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.

 Posted: Feb 11, 2020 12:22PM
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Hey everyone
Long time no post and I can't find it by searching. 
Anyway On the Suzuki/mini 4x4 project. I am having a fuel issue. the Beast (we call him Stevie the wonder mini) will run for about 20 minutes then shut off. I have done the trouble shooting and have confirmed that the "sock" in the fuel tank is not letting enough fuel though. I also think that the time is not really a factor it has just been that long running back and fore in the driveway plowing snow. if I was to open the throttle and rev it above 2k it would likely "run out of fuel" faster.
it is a mechanical pump on the engine and as far as I can find it is about the same volume as a mini the engine is a 970 and I am running a SU carb on it. I am told that is an upgrade over whatever came on it.

So the Fuel tank is a standard mini tank that would have been on every mini sold in Canada until 79 when they stopped bringing them in. How do you change the sock? I can see it if I get the flash light pointing just the right way and there is not too much gas in the tank. But there is no way I can get a hand into the filler neck or throught that tiny little hole that the sending unit uses.

Do I just get a long "stick" and poke at the sock until it falls off and then add a super fuel filter at the tank? How does it come apart?


Once you replace everything that is attached to something else. It will all be fixed.