I 2nd connecting w/ Gildred Racing. Even if you're not planing to buy a turn-key VTECH from them, I'm sure they'd be happy to answer all of your questions about your project. Their shop is located about 20 mins from me. I've inspected some of their cars. Seems like they do nice work.

//www.gildredracing.com/about/

This is all speculation. The only people who can answer your question (since you are a Black and White person) is DMV themselves. We can only offer internet conjecture.

thanks for the reply steve,  i think my question was answered,  doesnt matter how many hundreds of swapped cars are in CA,  if you have one not properly inspected than it is illegal.  plain and simple.  in my mind makes it no different than a revin.  just saying

no arguement from me on conversions, i have owned more converted minis than anyone this side of the pond.   after driving my 16v twini for a couple years i would have to say i prefer the torque of the vtec or vaux more.      

Regardless what the laws in California are interpenetrated to be, There are thousands of later model V-8s in old hotrods and hundreds of non 'A'-series powered Minis in the state and I have never heard of one getting busted for the engine swap. It may be technically illegal, but it is obviously not enforced when the cars are a pre-smog vintage. You can do pretty much anything you want to the older cars, without worries. Concerning the cost of a swap; the popularly thrown around number of $25,000 is way off from reality, unless you are having a shop build you a turn-key, then 30K or even 50k is a possibility. If you are reasonably skilled at working on your Mini, and have a lot of patience, you can do the swap for under 10K. I did my first one for little more than the cost of the Civic front clip I started with; about 5,000$ total for the basic swap. My partners D-series swap will come in under 7,000 when complete. We sold our own kits for about 4K, which included the sub frame, motor mounts, axles, header, radiator, pedal box, and track rods. add 2-3K for the power train, and a couple thousand more for wiring, ECU, fuel pump,fan, brake and fuel lines ect. and you're still under 10K. The component cost is really not the issue, as everyone seems to think. You will have hundreds of hours (possibly years) into the build if you do it right there is an unbelievable amount of work to do. My quickest customer's build was about 3 months and he had a gang of people helping him day and night. You can get it running in a month or less, but it's the scores of finishing details to get everything "right" that drag it out for many additional months typically. You actually can build a VTEC mini that makes a great daily driver and a race track warrior, but to build a car that is fun and satisfying, that you won't want to sell after driving it a couple weeks, takes about 3 times more work and a superior kit design to start with. The bad rep for these VTEC conversions is due mainly to the poorly engineered kits that are being sold to ill informed buyers/builders who are not able to make design modifications and don't do the finishing details to get it right. I have driven my car twice to Canada for Mini Meet; close to 7,000 miles total for the round trips from San Diego; also to Oregon twice, Arizona once and several thousand more miles around Southern California. The car is ultra reliable, gets over 40 MPG and is usually the fastest car at the MMW autocross events. This VTEC Mini will never be sold for 30K or 100K for that matter. I love it more than life. I wish all you guys who have heard the bad stories about these conversions could experience a drive in my Mini or one of our customers well finished cars; they are actually better than an "A" series Mini in almost all respects.

thanks for that spank,   my basic question was/is    is it legal to swap a motor in a mini from another vehicle?  is an inspection a requirement?  is it even allowed per a strict reading of the law?    i have a good friend selling his vtec and i advised him not to attempt a sale in CA even though his shell is legal being a pre 1975.   i think your answer reinforces my advise to him.

It's not just DMV but also CARB (California Air Resources Board) that has its weiner in the punchbowl.

I'm too lazy to look for the specifics, I do know that when installing a B16 vtec in a Honda that had, say, a D15 non-vtec then the car must go to a smog referee and get a CARB sticker or BAR (Bureau of Automotive Repair) sticker and the car is then smogged based on the new engine install. Engines can be UPdated (made newer) but they cannot be backdated. So putting a 1965 Chevy 350 in a 2010 Corvette does not mean you can be smog exempt. Heck, Californians can't even put a cold air intake on their car if it doesn't have a CARB compliance sticker on it.

Just like I'm too lazy to look up the specifics, so are most enforcement agencies. If someone wants to be stupic-ly obvious and flaunt their non-conformity, it'll eventually get the attention of someone who wants a promotion or is looking to otherwise climb ladders. They'll then make a stink and make some arrests or file some cases to pad their professional resume'. This happened in the mini community in the not-too-distant past.  But most things just go the way of the drug testing of your local Hardware/Department store applicants-- only a small number of them actually get scruitinized (which leads to all of these stories of why taking Vitamin X or Mineral Z in mass quantities helps you pass a piss test if you got stoned the night before--  their sample never got tested because THAT would take money and effort. The fear of doing something wrong and the threat of getting busted is the largest enforcement agent.

Boyd Coddington got busted but more because of lost tax revenue from inaccurate vehicle value than for emissions evasion. While it was part of the initial investigation, I don't think they did anything with it and he pleabargained his way down from $7,728,000 in lost dmv revenue to pleading guilty to a misdemeanor and paying a $3000 fine and performing 160 hours of community service (link)

well hugh the reason i asked is back in the 70's i converted  my 240z to a scarab,   these swap cars were designed by a CA firm and it was based on a 1966 chevy 327 small block.  they claimed it had to be this old to avoid the CA emission laws.  so wouldnt it follow that a vtec swap  had to be a smogged and tested motor?   most ground up street rods use factory chassis's like a mustang II which would comply with safety standards and putting a 350 or bigger in your camaro that came with a 6 cylinder is nothing more than swapping a 1275 for a 998 which wouldnt require an inspection.   CA seems to have more stringent laws than most states so shouldnt a conversion be declared and inspected? 

Hahaha, now im having second thought of moving to Ca. I'm a person full of logic and oozing with common sense, im afraid i might not jive in with the california community and people cant measure up with  my level of thinking,... hmm but we'll see.

I believe the correct thing to do is apply for a title for a vehicle of special construction or SPCNS Certificate of Sequence. But I'm no expert. This is just speculation on my part. I've used the same logic as Dr. Mini. But this is CA: Logic doesn't apply here.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/?1dmy&urile=wcmpath:/dmv_content_en/dmv/vr/spcns

I'm no expert, and I don't live in California but here's a thought. Is a VTEC swap no more than putting a 350 Chevy motor in a T-bucket street rod? Apples and oranges? Not really. Both of them started out as old cars with little engines. Doing the swap you have added horsepower to an otherwise slower vehicle. I know they have street rods there so I personally don't see a difference. Now, swapping VIN plates is specifically against the law. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. Very different.

i asked the following on another thread,  is it legal to have a vtec converted mini in CA?    i would think not but not an expert,  however i see this was addressed in an earlier post from 62 cooper S.   so my question is:  is it lawful to have a vtec swap in CA?  if not  what would differ from having a vin swap in CA?   doesnt seem like either is worth the chance?  

more appropriate or informed forum

//www.16vminiclub.com/index.php?s=c32a502552fdc627986ef165aa08db3f

As far the cost of doing the Honda install, the cost would be dependant on how much of the work you are willing and can do yourself. You can very easily drop $20,000 into this type of project.

A long time Mini owner and poster here NJ who unfortunately is no longer with us started with a 998cc Mini. He then went to a 1275, then a 1380, then a Honda B series twin cam, then a Honda CRV AWD set up all in the same car. Only after the last build was he satisfied but he still ended up selling it. If you want to do any big engine big HP build in a Mini due to the limitations of the car and wheel size options and getting the power to the ground you are way ahead of the game going at least RWD like Freddy S did with his build. 
For the money and availability of parts and expense a Honda D series with around 130 hp using a lot of the Mini parts is the way to go (see John Mc Ghee's thread).
Good luck with the build but save the MK I and think about using a MK III> roll up window shell (CA compliant of course).

And by the way im putting a 170hp auto transmission SUV engine in the back of my mini, i dont think torque steer will be an issue. 

Where did the $30K estimate came from?  All you need is a $2500 subframe and a used Honda integra donor car that's worth about $1500 used with salvage title. And few bucks on welding and pipes for rollcage if you like. I dont think it would even total to 10K all in all...seeesh!!

I would definitely talk to Tyler at Gildred Racing in Santa Barbara. Fantastic shop and great group of workers. I was going with a Type R B18 JDM red top engine on my clubman but traded it for a D17 Vtec SOHC. So much easier and fun to drive. Check it out

Thanks for all the input! I didn't realize that the vtec swap was so controversial, but I guess I should've expected that considering how unique the platform is. 

This is going to sound strange, but to me, driving the finished product is pretty much secondary to the build itself, that's the part that I really enjoy. That said, I understand that I'll pretty much never get back the $ I put into it, but I consider it a partial offset to the cost of a hobby that I (usually) enjoy. 

I had actually budgeted around ~$17k for the project, I'd like to do a sanity check with you guys and see if I'm even in the ballpark. Since so much stuff is missing, I'm strongly leaning toward making it more of a track build with the option of restoring the interior / hvac stuff at a later time if I end up going in that direction. 

- $5k shell (already purchased, literally a bare chassis with wheels that's been sitting as a half finished project for the last 10-15 years, currently going rust protection)
- $5k chassis - essentials to getting the car running under its own power (brakes, steering, seats, fuel lines, misc)
- $3.5k minitec b series kit
- $2.5-3.5k b series motor (another question I had for vtec folks - is the type r b series worth the premium?)

$25k sounds like a lot to me, that's in the range of my prior swap project that had to deal with the issues of a RWD drivetrain, ac, and PS. Since mini and Honda stuff seems to be priced fairly reasonably, I'd think that since almost everything associated with the swap is north of the firewall, it would be a little less expensive and complex. Just as a little bit of a background (while on the topic of controversy), here's a pic of my old project - a v8 rx7. I guess I could be called a hot rodder of sorts. 

Stu, brother,

You don't want to end this thread without hearing my take on this.

First, how do you intend to use your classic mini? 
1) weekend leisure ride around town with wife?
2) to park at starbucks while sipping on your $1.50 coffee?
3) to attend to monthly cars and coffee get together and brag about your Vtec engine? and do burn rubber as you leave the parking lot?(like what jerseymini does every weekend )
4) for errands/ grocery getter?(purists)
5) keep inside the garage and collect cub webs? (like most projects end up into )
6) or restore and keep it stock for the rest of it's mini life, and attend an annual British car show/or concourse?   (purists)
7) do long highway trips? (like what i intend to do )


you know, $25K estimate on Vtec conversion is too much... do what jerseymini did, he bought a super beat up, Honda Integra with salvage title for $500 and scoop the engine and wire harness out of the car. Then sold the rest of the car parts to ebay, he end up getting more on what he paid for.  now he got a matte blue mini which he drives during car shows and illegal street racing in New jersey USA. 
where cops don't care about street racing, and don't care about minis and scooters.

So bottomline, asses your lifestyle, if you fit on having a Vtec mini then go for it...just an advice, dont get so excited, easy with spending because when your itch for speed diminishes, you will end up selling your vtec mini for a lot less than what you build it for.
if you decide to do the conversion, there is an article in this forum that show you all the make,style and year of honda engine available and the subframe that goes with it. i believe B series, D series and K series has different  subframes,not sure.
And our host carries all types of vtec subframes you needed. 

so it's all up to you...


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Me? i have a different plan, im putting a modern engine in the back of my mini, automatic transmission, i dont want manual stick shift, i dont want to waste my energy shifting,i just want to step on the gas and move forward.  
Yes, it may look like a Zcar but a very QUIET Zcar. i will extend the length of the pipe and i will install original muffler and Catalytic converter. and i will make sure that it will be a very quiet ,reliable and powerful mini that can cross the country. It will be a first ever build in this planet. , yes,the Remastered mini is modern when it come to interior , but its engine is still an A-series engine. be it 1380 or 1400cc,,, STILL an A-series, they are high rev engines and they overheat when you get stuck in a heavy traffic.....nope,not in my bucketlist.

------>  https://youtu.be/6C52pizDWow