3.3/4 gal 110 octane leaded race gas mixed with 1 1/4 gal 100 octane low lead avgas in each 5 gal can. Resulting 102 octane non/ethenol gas works great in the Mini and all my lawn machines with no problems.  Down side is not being able to take long trips with the 5 1/2 gal fuel tank.  I only get 5 gal of pump gas at a time over the winter in the Insight since the 10 gal tank would last over 3 months unless I take a trip out of town.  Oregon changed over to ethenol much later than California, so I never left Ashland without filling up with their 92 oct regular.  It made about a 3 or 4 mpg gain in the Insight.

just for interest I changed the oil after 2000 miles and all of the wear indicators were down to unit standard numbers, I always made sure that any trips were always over 30 miles minumum, I also changed from the standard 15w40 to a 5w40 synthetic. The increase in silicone was from a mentally retarded rodent which tore into my air filter in storage and I didnt check and got more air borne oil contamination. Does show the importance of good air filtration though

cheers

Barri

Hi Carl

yes - no dithering on that answer. If you are going to store the car fill it up with gas (if you use ethanol free gas add a stabilizer). Change the oil and just run the engine for a few seconds to get the new oil circulating around everything. then disconnect the battery and put it on a trickle charger and dont touch it again until you need it. When you do restart - if over 3 or 4 months - pull the plugs and put a few cc's of oil in each hole and crank the engine over (with no plugs) until you get pressure. Slap the plugs back in and run the engine and use as normal

If you do start it in the middle of storage get it up to temp and if possible get it to sit there long enough to burn off any condensation so you get the least amount of acid formed after cool down. Of course if you run synthetic oil it doesnt really matter as synthetics are pretty much (but not totally) immune from the acid problem.

cheers

Barri

Barri,

So from your knowledge and experiance are you saying it is better not to start up a vehicle that is say stored for months at a time?  That is unless one takes it out for a spirted run getting the temps all the way up?

Thanks,

Carl

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Comment on ethanol in fuel from Sweden:

"Yes, the Saab 9-3 SportsCombi 2008 ym runs mostly on E85 (85% ethanol 15% petrol), but I can put in normal 95 octane petrol as well, any mix.  During the winter the petrol companies changes the recipe to E75 (75% ethanol 25% petrol), to make the cars easier to start.

Normal petrol is sold with 5% ethanol, as 95 or 98 octane.  They are discussing about increasing to 10% in the 95 octane.  For a while you could buy Shell V-Power without ethanol, but today no petrol without ethanol is aviable anymore.

We just fill up the Minis with petrol 98 octane/5% ethanol, put in some "lead replacement" and drive.  I have not heard about anyone changing hoses or gaskets, yet.  I can listen around and see if I can find out anything that I dont know about the Swedish market."

(Note: writer owns and drives a 1959 Mini shipped to Sweden on Sept. 26th, 1959, a Moke and a '62 Cooper that is rally equipped)

the oil that gets burned in the combustion chamber forms super oxides of sulphur.

 just for information - a brief description. The chemistry is that when a hot engine cools down condensation forms on the inner walls of the engine this runs down into the oil where it combines with sulphur oxides in the oil to form sulphuric acid. The water in the oil may then boil off on the next run but the sulphuric acid that was formed is stable enough to remain in the oil - its a cumulative effect. All oil builds up sulphuric acid and its formed after a hot run and once its formed its pretty stable. You have to get the engine hot and form sulphur oxides (from the oil burning) in the combustion chamber, these enter back into the oil and combine with moisture after a hot run, all engines form these and they form them all of the time. The problem is just worse if you let contaminated oil sit in the engine.

I have added in a blackstone report from my landrover after I changed the oil then parked it for almost 14 months. I thought I was doing a good job starting it every week or 2 to keep the fluids moving - but not so (I should have known better) It chewed off some of my bearing surfaces! Newer synthetic oils suffer from the problem a lot less

cheers

Barri

Where does all this sulphur come from ?

a dry system or system with air pockets is the worst. If you fill your car with ethanol free gas (pure-gas.org lists the gas stations by state) then you need to add a stabiliser such as stabil (which adds propylalcohol, ethanol, isobutanol and or a kerosene base). the best thing is to add the gas in winter so you get the more volatile blend (summer gas blend has a lot of crap added to stop it venting fumes too much) and add a stabilizer or just keep the tank full.

Dont run the engine if you are not going to get it up to temp as the oil builds up huge amounts of sulphur products and condensation and you make lots of sulphuric acid.

cheers

Barri

I think running an engine and fuel system dry would cause more issues, wouldn't it?

So none the less- Fact / Vs Fiction/ Vs Real life.. Gasoline is now gasohol and should be regarded differently for an engine or motor that either sits vs being  used...

  If a manufacture regards stale gas is the cause of issues -- sort of immeadeatly condemns Ethanol as not great over time!  Boats/ Small Engines In All!

   We all know over the past 10 years... fuel wont last if sitting.  I remember being able to run a car on years old fuel - Pull it out of storage- it would run- Now nothing runs well on 6 month old fuel....

Does ethanol attract moisture causing these isuses?  Or is the ethanol breaking down?

I would say there is a reason - Chevrolet- requires NON Ethanol Fuel in their wonderful VOLT. ELECTRIC / Gas Hybrid CAR..  This as I read - is becasue Volt owners can go MONTHS without even fueling up - or using fuel - As that gasoline ages in a CLOSED SYSTEM they want to ensure it doesnt go completley stale - Requesing owners to use Ethanol free keeps the staleness issue at bay.     Volt even has a monitoring system - if it detects stale fule or - no new fuel added it will require the gas engine to run to burn it down and require the owner to refuel with Fresh.

Ethanol is here to stay - so im just seeing strong needs to plan accordingly with engines as you may use or not use them.
 Everyone has their personal prefrence.. I will continue to run my engines empty where possible.

The braided fuel hoses that come from our host and the suppliers in England -- should they be used with our fuel with ethanol?? 

Jim

The sticking valve issue we first ran into years ago. Living on the coast we have lots of boats. At the machine shop we had lots of stuck and bent valves come spring. What we found was the gas would go bad over the winter. People would start their boats comespring and they would not run very good but they would run. Once they shut them down the bad gas coated the valve stems and formed what was very much like an epoxy around the stems. Once it colled and set up the next time they cranked the engine it would miss or bend some valves break rockers and bend push rods. Best approach is to remove all old gas, back flush lines, replace filter and fill with fresh fuel before cranking. I'm playing with some 38 HIFs at the shop. I had trouble removing the bottom plate glued on with what looked like varnish. Steve (CTR)

I have to agree with helpmymini, actual data is much better than rumor - let the flaming begin

whilst ethanol may have a bad rep it actually increases the octane even though the power is slightly reduced and knock should be much improved. Straight chemistry look it up anywhere.

all of the water driers and stabilizers used in the tanks over winter are a blend of alcohols - usually propanol and ethanol because they do absorb water and will still burn (not well but they will explode)

Nearly all of the problems involved with supposedly bad ethanol gas are related directly to stale gas not ethanol gas. I also think that just about every modern rubber part from a reputable manufacture is going to be ethanol resistant. You are at the end of the day better off using ethanol gas if you have replaced most of the original rubber parts in the system.

cheers

Barri

Can't be too bad..most people I know drink the stuff..

Cheers, Ian

Mark, my statement earlier agrees with all of that

We are saying the same thing. Keep water out of the gas (with appropriate storage and usage, and ethanol-tolerant parts) and gasohol works fine in that setting, but not in others.

Knowledge is better than rumor. Know what you are talking about before blaming something. Mercury (the boat motor company) recently put out a document stating that most boat (and small engine) fuel problems are due to stale fuel, NOT the ethanol in it. link below

Ethanol is a detergent, NOT the source of the varnish and sludge. Most issues arise because of cruddy tanks and lines getting cleaned by ethanol not the other way around. link below

No wars have been fought over ethanol (except on this forum maybe),

No beaches have been closed due to ethanol spills,

You won't have to wait millions of years to replenish your ethanol reserves,

Get with the times people. We are giving the middle east 2-3 million dollars a day for it's oil. Where do you think they are spending that money?

Mercedes

Mercury

stale gas

Actually , some of us think that may be the incorrect thing to do:

(1) running until out of gas in a 2-cycle means no oil/lubrication either. I realize it may be only for few seconds, but still...

(2) running until out of gas means rubber diaphrams, flaps, seals will dry out and perhaps get stuck, or brittle

(3) running until out of gas means the tank is full of air WITH water vapor. Vapor will condense when it touches cold metal . Better to keep tank full , and run the engine occasionally, let's say once a month.

(4) OBTW - many so-called fuel stabilizers are alcohol-based. If way too much is added to an ethanol fuel, it increases the concentration and may be detrimental to parts that are not so ethanol-tolerant.

I also realize that some of these comments may reflect my bias based on small engine repair. Back when Steve (CTR) was driving his Model A, and later racing his mini, I was fixing mopeds, mowers, generators, etc, etc,  Harvey

Absoutly Agree with all comments- I think alot of advise should be given to the community to  say hey - Use Ethanol Free.

  My dad has replaced 3 gas tanks in the past year due to sludge and junk- beyond the norm of a sitting car. As it used to be... Even his own personal BGT Is getting a new tank.    Now he's worried about putting fuel in a new tank and the problem of sludge coming right back.  Ethanol free will be come the norm for vintage cars.  Nice 7-11  here has 94 octane - ethanol free $4.29 per gallon! 

 I have a Mk 1 and a Moke that dont get used alot so - for sure will be moving to all Ethanol free from now on.... 

To add: Mother in law gave me 2 small engine items.... Pressure washer-- no fuel in tank, ran empty put away... Added fuel -RUNS GREAT.. 

  Sthil Chainsaw.. Ive watched this saw sit for over a year- litttle no NO use..... someone went to use it.. idles but wont jump and run.  I suspect blocked passages... She was ready to throw it out.. I will clean an repeat and see to ressurect.   Planned obsolesence?

My personal equipment - i do try and run empty and put away .. Hedge / Weed eater/ Chainsaw / now - pressurewasher all apply/ Even the leaf blower is hard to start if sitting over 2 - 3 months...

great real -life stories.  keep em coming

There was a thread similar to this here before . Some guy in the farmland-exhausting corn ethanol business gave his song and dance about how good his product was. But while it may work on new and regularly used vehicles, it is problematic in the infrequently used minis, chainsaw, boats, etc we are discussing here.

NEVER ever use ethonal in car with carb.s.  if it sits over the winter.. will turn to glue  SNOT looking nastly stuff..   I always spend the money and use 94  Octane with NO ethanol..