Created by: | Orig. Posting Date | User Name | Edit Date |
| Sep 14, 2018 05:51PM | 1963SV2 | |
| Sep 14, 2018 02:35PM | h_lankford | |
| Sep 14, 2018 01:00PM | Dan Moffet | |
| Sep 14, 2018 12:45PM | Cheleker | |
| Sep 14, 2018 11:11AM | charrison | Edited: Sep 15, 2018 11:32AM |
| Sep 14, 2018 05:24AM | h_lankford | |
| Sep 13, 2018 11:17PM | charrison | |
| Sep 13, 2018 04:15PM | mediumcool | |
| Sep 13, 2018 02:40PM | 1963SV2 | |
| Sep 13, 2018 01:34PM | MiniBill | |
| Sep 13, 2018 10:42AM | malsal | |
| Sep 13, 2018 09:01AM | scottwkurth | |
| Sep 13, 2018 01:48AM | charrison | Edited: Sep 13, 2018 01:53AM |
| Sep 12, 2018 08:36AM | scottwkurth | |
| Sep 11, 2018 11:30AM | mediumcool | Edited: Sep 11, 2018 12:09PM |
| Sep 11, 2018 08:49AM | malsal | |
| Sep 11, 2018 08:23AM | mediumcool | |
| Sep 11, 2018 08:20AM | mediumcool | |
| Sep 11, 2018 02:58AM | Alex | |
| Sep 10, 2018 11:53PM | charrison |
Found 21 Messages
Posted:
Sep 14, 2018
05:51PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h_lankford
Dan - thanks for the clarification, I only got one out of two correct.
the rule means that the “theoretical loose pad” has “been dragged” on the upper shoe forward (clockwise) in the direction of travel of the drum on the Right side, so yes, photo looks good
good thing I did not try to tackle anti-clockwise terminology.
Harvey
Ian want to chime back in ?
the rule means that the “theoretical loose pad” has “been dragged” on the upper shoe forward (clockwise) in the direction of travel of the drum on the Right side, so yes, photo looks good
good thing I did not try to tackle anti-clockwise terminology.
Harvey
Ian want to chime back in ?
Cheers, Ian
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Dan - thanks for the clarification, I only got one out of two correct.
the rule means that the “theoretical loose pad” has “been dragged” on the upper shoe forward (clockwise) in the direction of travel of the drum on the Right side, so yes, photo looks good
good thing I did not try to tackle anti-clockwise terminology.
Harvey
Ian want to chime back in ?
the rule means that the “theoretical loose pad” has “been dragged” on the upper shoe forward (clockwise) in the direction of travel of the drum on the Right side, so yes, photo looks good
good thing I did not try to tackle anti-clockwise terminology.
Harvey
Ian want to chime back in ?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h_lankford
Quote:
Originally Posted by charrison
Perhaps we're getting hung up on the leading/trailing stuff. Not the best picture, but its the best I could find.
RH front twin LS drum brakes. The gap in the friction material next to the slave cyl.
RH front twin LS drum brakes. The gap in the friction material next to the slave cyl.
If so, this RHD rotating clockwise would have "slid" the shoe material in the opposite direction you have these installed. You have the gap on the trailing edge near the brake cylinder. By the "rule" , it should be on the leading edge.
This is what 1963SV2 said.
As I understand it, with twin-leading shoes, when the brake lining comes in contact with the drum, the friction tends to pull (grab) the lining, thereby assisting the force applied by the cylinder. Perhaps the section of shoe without lining adds a bit of leverage to the equation.
.
"Hang on a minute lads....I've got a great idea."
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The photo is of a right front wheel (the way the slave is pointed and the location of the adjuster confirms it) and the shoes are correct.
Think of both the front and rear brakes as having the friction material pushed forward by the drum as the car moves forward.
Think of both the front and rear brakes as having the friction material pushed forward by the drum as the car moves forward.
Edited:
Sep 15, 2018
11:32AM
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Its not my picture, simply one I found on the net.
But it does "look like the friction material has slid (backwards??) on the shoe from the rotation when moving forward."
Just trying to help really.
But it does "look like the friction material has slid (backwards??) on the shoe from the rotation when moving forward."
Just trying to help really.
Car engines make CO2 and trees absorb CO2. By running your engine you're feeding a tree and helping the environment.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charrison
Perhaps we're getting hung up on the leading/trailing stuff. Not the best picture, but its the best I could find.
RH front twin LS drum brakes. The gap in the friction material next to the slave cyl.
RH front twin LS drum brakes. The gap in the friction material next to the slave cyl.
If so, this RHD rotating clockwise would have "slid" the shoe material in the opposite direction you have these installed. You have the gap on the trailing edge near the brake cylinder. By the "rule" , it should be on the leading edge.
This is what 1963SV2 said.
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Perhaps we're getting hung up on the leading/trailing stuff. Not the best picture, but its the best I could find.
RH front twin LS drum brakes. The gap in the friction material next to the slave cyl.
RH front twin LS drum brakes. The gap in the friction material next to the slave cyl.
Car engines make CO2 and trees absorb CO2. By running your engine you're feeding a tree and helping the environment.
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She's 50 years old, but the brakes were rebuilt by a well-known (at least on the west coast) trusted professional 5 years ago and then she sat in a garage mostly. I mentioned it to him and he told me to consider converting to disc brakes. I am of the thought that after sitting 5 years with a rebuilt brake system, a little more frequent driving will help and I've just taken possession of her recently. So I've ruled out bad parts and faulty installation in favor of suspecting minor adjustments and more driving. I will keep you posted.
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"The gap should go at the "trailing" end, when considering the rotation of the drum / wheel..."
Are you absolutely sure......
I don't do mine that way.
Sections M.2 and M.3 of my (BMC) Mini Workshop Manual (AKD4935) shows views of right hand brake assemblies. Being the right hand wheel, the wheel would rotate clockwise when moving forward. This means the bare section of the shoe is at the LEADING edge. Further on, Fig. M.14 shows a left hand front hub and the same rules apply.
You might argue that the right hand hub is the one on the right as look at the front of the car - which would reverse the logic above. However, Minis are right hand drive and right is determined looking forward .. as is the convention in the aeronautic and nautical world. I couldn't actually find this defined in the manual however I have always used the assumption that a "right hand" component is on the drivers side of a RHD vehicle....
As for weak braking in reverse..... I suggest there is something wrong with the components or assembly.
If the brakes didn't well in reverse you couldn't do a front end throw...... To be successful the brakes need to lock....
Cheers, Ian
Are you absolutely sure......
I don't do mine that way.
Sections M.2 and M.3 of my (BMC) Mini Workshop Manual (AKD4935) shows views of right hand brake assemblies. Being the right hand wheel, the wheel would rotate clockwise when moving forward. This means the bare section of the shoe is at the LEADING edge. Further on, Fig. M.14 shows a left hand front hub and the same rules apply.
You might argue that the right hand hub is the one on the right as look at the front of the car - which would reverse the logic above. However, Minis are right hand drive and right is determined looking forward .. as is the convention in the aeronautic and nautical world. I couldn't actually find this defined in the manual however I have always used the assumption that a "right hand" component is on the drivers side of a RHD vehicle....
As for weak braking in reverse..... I suggest there is something wrong with the components or assembly.
If the brakes didn't well in reverse you couldn't do a front end throw...... To be successful the brakes need to lock....
Cheers, Ian
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As charrison said, the double leading shoe (duplex).front brakes are.less effective in.reverse. You are effectively using 1/2 of your brakes. What I did.in the VW days was to use the handbrake lever to assist the footbrakes when backing on a hill. Push the release knob in so it doesn't lock and make sure it tightly adjusted.
Since you had the brakes done years ago and haven't driven it much, the brakes may just need to bed in and settle. And sometimes a new brake job needs readjustment afyer a few miles.
Old cars can be fun.
--Bill
Since you had the brakes done years ago and haven't driven it much, the brakes may just need to bed in and settle. And sometimes a new brake job needs readjustment afyer a few miles.
Old cars can be fun.
--Bill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottwkurth
Quote:
Originally Posted by malsal
A lot of Mini drum brakes are installed incorrectly if you have not done so you need to check that they are in fact installed correctly.
If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.
Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.
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That's really helpful—thanks! Next time I am adjusting the brakes I'll open up the drums and check the shoes.
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Scott | 1963 Austin Cooper | 2003 MINI Cooper S | 2018 MINI Cooper 4-door
Scott | 1963 Austin Cooper | 2003 MINI Cooper S | 2018 MINI Cooper 4-door
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The shoes are not fully covered in friction material, but have a gap at one end.
The gap should go at the "trailing" end, when considering the rotation of the drum / wheel.
Also, as far as the parking brake is concerned, wear on all moving parts is critical, esp the levers in the drum which engage with the shoes. Check the sectors on the radius arms are free to move, and grease the channels on the rear s/frame.
The gap should go at the "trailing" end, when considering the rotation of the drum / wheel.
Also, as far as the parking brake is concerned, wear on all moving parts is critical, esp the levers in the drum which engage with the shoes. Check the sectors on the radius arms are free to move, and grease the channels on the rear s/frame.
Car engines make CO2 and trees absorb CO2. By running your engine you're feeding a tree and helping the environment.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malsal
A lot of Mini drum brakes are installed incorrectly if you have not done so you need to check that they are in fact installed correctly.
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Scott | 1963 Austin Cooper | 2003 MINI Cooper S | 2018 MINI Cooper 4-door
Scott | 1963 Austin Cooper | 2003 MINI Cooper S | 2018 MINI Cooper 4-door
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The brakes were rebuilt and installed professionally by a local specialist about 5 years ago and then the Mini was driven hardly any miles after that. I am of the mind to do minor adjustments and repairs myself as I feel that is the point of having it. I have a good service manual and will try the needed adjustments. I certainly appreciate the advice! I just did not know if this was normal for a fifty-year-old Mini as this is my first one.
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A lot of Mini drum brakes are installed incorrectly if you have not done so you need to check that they are in fact installed correctly.
If in doubt, flat out. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.
Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,
make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. Colin Chapman.
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Got it, thanks!
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That makes sense, thank you.
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The handbrake travel is compensated by shortening the cables - the adjuster/s for doing it are under the carpet just behind the lever. You should set the rear brake adjustment on the backplate correctly before adjusting the lever to be fully on at three clicks.
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If your car has standard drum brakes, it will have twin leading shoes at the front, and single leaders on the back. This is a description of the way the shoe pivots to touch the drum.
This means you have 6 shoes doing optimum braking going forwards, but only 2 shoes giving optimum braking going backwards.
Upto '64 Minis had single leading shoe brakes on all 4 wheels, but this was changed as it was felt better braking forwards was needed (albeit at the expense of backwards efficiency).
This means you have 6 shoes doing optimum braking going forwards, but only 2 shoes giving optimum braking going backwards.
Upto '64 Minis had single leading shoe brakes on all 4 wheels, but this was changed as it was felt better braking forwards was needed (albeit at the expense of backwards efficiency).
Car engines make CO2 and trees absorb CO2. By running your engine you're feeding a tree and helping the environment.
Found 21 Messages
